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Post by gramophone on Feb 9, 2009 9:39:41 GMT -6
Steve, Your machine is fantastic.I have a question....on the paper label under the cab,does it state the price??.On mine it is $105.00,but there is a second label called a "second hand special license"with a hand written price of $100.00.The serial # is also hand written on this label.I think when new this machine had the black fibre horn and was traded in to a dealer later,re-furbished and put with a all brass horn and re-sold by Victor.Have any collectors seen or have this (SHSL) label on any of their Victors???. Wayne
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schweg
Three Spring Motor
Posts: 218
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Post by schweg on Feb 9, 2009 9:58:42 GMT -6
I'll look when I get home from work... Gotta work to spend money on phonos!!
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schweg
Three Spring Motor
Posts: 218
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Post by schweg on Feb 9, 2009 10:00:34 GMT -6
Gramophone, I've been meaning to say that your machine is a beaut. Good to see that mine has a soul mate out there....
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Post by gramophone on Feb 9, 2009 10:08:00 GMT -6
Thank you Steve!!. I'm not sure,but I don't think there are too many all brass horns out there.As for #10's who knows!!??.I have to tell you I don't keep the brass horn on the 6.I use a spear tip (it's smaller)instead and I keep the brass horn on my mahogany 5.If you send me your email I can send you pics of the label I mentioned. Wayne
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schweg
Three Spring Motor
Posts: 218
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Post by schweg on Feb 9, 2009 17:03:13 GMT -6
Wayne, The printed label says $100. Not handwritten..
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Post by gramophone on Feb 9, 2009 18:59:47 GMT -6
That's interesting.Has you see in the pic I sent you Mine is printed $105.00.We were told that the extra 5 was because it had the #10.Then when re-sold by Victor they Hand wrote on the other label #100.00.A whole 5.00 discount and you get the brass horn.SOLD!!!
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zeppy
One Spring Motor
Posts: 30
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Post by zeppy on Feb 10, 2009 12:35:19 GMT -6
Steve, Your machine is fantastic.I have a question....on the paper label under the cab,does it state the price??.On mine it is $105.00,but there is a second label called a "second hand special license"with a hand written price of $100.00.The serial # is also hand written on this label.I think when new this machine had the black fibre horn and was traded in to a dealer later,re-furbished and put with a all brass horn and re-sold by Victor.Have any collectors seen or have this (SHSL) label on any of their Victors???. Wayne I have a Second Hand license label on the bottom of my VTLA. The regular license was on the inside compartment by the horn. I didn't even notice the Second Hand label until I started to restore the machine, and had it on its back. I don't recall what the second hand price was...I'll have to double check. The story, from my understanding, was that in the early days, Victor claimed the machines were merely licenced to people, rather than flat out sold. Under their theory, an individual could never sell their Victor, but had to return it to an authorized dealer (they could then control the resale price of used Victors). This was eventually challenged, and Victor's bizare "licensing" scheme was shot down by the courts.
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zeppy
One Spring Motor
Posts: 30
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Post by zeppy on Feb 14, 2009 8:31:49 GMT -6
Here's a picture of the 2nd hand label from my VTLA. Remarkably, the loose half was sitting in the drawer, and considering the condition of the machine overall when I got it, it's even more remarable it survived (although the seller did have the manual for the machine as well...which he sold to someone else). Sadly, it is missing the piece that has the price. The tear starts right after the dollar sign, so I have no idea what they resold the VTLAs for. BTW...any suggestions as to what to use to re-glue the loose half?
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Post by gramophone on Feb 14, 2009 10:18:23 GMT -6
Zeppy, I would use a good white glue to hold it in place.I would put a thin layer on the case and a thin layer on the label.When I say "THIN" I mean just a film.I should add that my pic of my label is under the Victor #10 listing if you want to compare labels. Regards,Wayne
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zeppy
One Spring Motor
Posts: 30
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Post by zeppy on Feb 14, 2009 12:01:44 GMT -6
Zeppy, I would use a good white glue to hold it in place.I would put a thin layer on the case and a thin layer on the label.When I say "THIN" I mean just a film.I should add that my pic of my label is under the Victor #10 listing if you want to compare labels. Regards,Wayne One think I found mildly interesting about my label is that they use XVI rather than VTLA as it appears on the metal ID plate...
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Post by gramophone on Feb 14, 2009 12:32:14 GMT -6
That's interesting.......I guess they ran out of VTLA labels or yours was put together as they were changing them to XVl's.It would be interesting if others have the same and check the #'s. wayne
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zeppy
One Spring Motor
Posts: 30
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Post by zeppy on Feb 14, 2009 15:27:58 GMT -6
Well, the metal tag says VTLA, it was the second hand notice that they wrote out as a XVI...which I suppose they were calling them XVI byt he time it was resold...but I just found it intersting that they wrote XVI rather than VTLA, which is what is on the metal tag.
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Post by gramophone on Feb 14, 2009 16:03:41 GMT -6
Well, that makes sense.If a dealer wanted to re-sell something that would have been deemed "out dated"why not re-sell it under the "new" name "Victrola 16".By then,I'm sure years later.A customer would have said "VTLA,what's that".In any case I seems that the re-sale label was used,but not very common.If anything it gives you a small time capsule of the machines life.For me with the "6".It tells me that it was traded in while the brass horn was new and the fibre horn was removed the #10 taken off and replaced with a exhibition and re-sold for 5.00 less than it was new.Based on the serial# it was made in the first year of production and the brass horn was introduced about 8- 10 years later so you do the math.What I find the most interesting out of all this,is Victor was able to re-sell this out dated machine for 5.00 less years later from 105.00 to 100.00.Now that's marketing!!!. Wayne
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Post by old-phonographs on Feb 14, 2009 18:05:53 GMT -6
I have had two L-door machines. There serial numbers were only a few hundred apart, but one was in the old cabinet for a VTLA with the carving and one looked like the later L-door XVI. Both machines had metal tags that said they were XVI machines. I think there was a transition occurring in 1909 or so when they changed from VTLA to XVI.
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Post by gramophone on Feb 14, 2009 18:49:32 GMT -6
I think the carved VTLA model was carried over to XVI to use up stock at the factory.I thought I should mention that the Vic VI 105.00 label was posted by mistake in the hot-air posting if anyone wants to see what it looks like. Wayne
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